War - Iraqi Definition vs. U.S. Definition

[DannyMay]

To an Iraqi War is when bombs are dropped all over your country. Your nation is blown apart by some foreign country who has no right to even be there. Many of your friends, family, co - workers, etc, are killed. Your young children lay in bed at night crying at every loud blast because they don't know what is going on. You are completly helpless as you must just hope you are lucky enough not to be hit by an errant bomb.



To an American War means - GOOD TELEVISION.

 

[Jazz]

Nope. Say, Danny, be sure to catch the villagers on TV who have been greeting the US and British troops with elation. Now THAT'S good TV.

Oh, yeah, I wonder what your definition of torture and killing of thousands of people will be, now that Saddam's soon to be bye-bye. Guess you'll probably use Bush.

 

[ldlax30]

Please dont tell me that you actually believe that all Americans believe war is good television. I highly doubt that the 200,000+ American troops fighting in this war, or their family, dont worry about dying, or having a missile or chemical weapon used on them. War is never and should never be a glamorous event. But good television is seeing Iraqi citizens dancing and celebrating in the streets when the US military came through. Just my oppinion.

 

[DannyMay]

yes I have seen villagers. I have also seen that many are still fighting our military instead of giving up, just as many are still fighting us in Afganistan. It should not be shocking to us that 10% of Iraq's population may give up to a country which is clearly 1000 more powerful than their own.

Whether someone believes that this war is necessary or not has absolutly nothing to do with my thread.

Whether you agree with the war or not, it is sickening the way Americans are sitting in front of their televisions with these disgusting grins on their faces. Americans are getting off on seeing this, like in some sort of way it is them kicking ass. Completly sickening. If it has to be done - do it, but it makes me sick the way we are clearly enjoying it.

Not a bit better than Al Queda or the palestinians who cheered in the street on 9 /11.

 

[DannyMay]

War is never and should never be a glamorous event.

I agree. However, in the U.S. today it is being shown in that light.

But good television is seeing Iraqi citizens dancing and celebrating in the streets when the US military came through.


Ok . We have all seen that. IS THE COVERAGE STILL ON ?????????

Please dont tell me that you actually believe that all Americans believe war is good television

Not All, but FAR too many believe this. There is a reason that it has been on every station round the clock, and it isnt because 5 people are watching.

 

[DannyMay]

They can show your villagers cheering or whatever they think is important on the news or break ins. However, there is a point where it is no longer news and just overkill. There comes a point where the joy being derived from this by Americans makes one sick to their stomach.

 

[DannyMay]

Trust me. If We REALLY knew war, we would not have the sickening kind of attitude.

Sure, we all remember 9/11. For most of us that is all we know of actual war. 3 hours in our lives where our country was the target, and we make out like that is the greatest crime ever committed.

3 hours ?? 3 hours is all we know of war. trust me if we knew years of it like Iraqi's do we would not all sit around our televisions with shit eating grins on our faces enjoying every second of this.

 

[Jazz]

Sure, there is overkill (pun not intended) on the cable channels and TV channels, but then this IS a big deal and no one said you don't have to watch it all the time. Turn it on, get an update, turn it off. Personally, I'm watching a lot of it, fascinating stuff (history being made, I mean), and hopefully I won't be seeing this much more soon when Saddam's regime kicks the bucket.

I did enjoy seeing his palace blow up, though, I will admit. I hope he was in it.

 

[Oceans11]

War is a big videogame to Americans.
The only taste the US got of it in the last 100 years was the twin towers.

250 million dreamers, and they run the world.

Oh, I forgot about Hawaii.
That place they stole from the Hawaiians.

The only part of the American empire thats actually seen war.
Let the Hawaiians choose, they'll let you come back as tourists, all these ex colonies do.
Take it from a brit, we've been there.

Give them back their country, go on, let the Royal Hawaiian Family return to their homeland and their people.

Or is it just another cuba?
Another dinky disney destination.

[This message was edited by eek on 03-21-03 at 05:55 PM.]

 

[Jazz]

"The only taste the US got of it in the last 100 years was the twin towers"

That's a good thing - thank you for pointing that out. I profusely apologize for the fact that, at least with respect to WWI and WWII, that the United States had the ill grace not to begin the conflicts that cost 25 million and 55 million lives on our soil, though we did save Europe's ass in both conflicts, conflicts which saw France and Germany pitted against each other, said nations now swooning on the sidelines against our action.

Man, Damned Americans don't know our PLACE in this world! We should only step in once Europe needs help or specifically approves it.

 

[DannyMay]

This is the last thing I will say on this topic and I know it will get me torched on this board, but its the truth.


Americans are no better than Al Queda or Bin Laden. Any American who thinks we are is living in dream land. Our government causes more problems in the world than any other entity on earth, just as the citizens of every other nation say. I hate what happened on 9/11 and I hope it doesnt happen again - but you know what I dont blame them 1 bit for feeling the way they feel. I am an American and I am sickened by it. If I was an arab living in the middle east right now I would probably want to kill Americans too, especially if I knew just how much they are enjoying this.

War supporters say it needs to be done, then do it. However, I have seen with my own eyes today just how much joy the average American is getting out of this. We are sending members of the media with the units so we can get good television out of it. They were talking about how Americans were not pleased with the coverage they recieved last time - WE WANT A CLOSER VIEW. WAR IS A GAME TO US.


I walked into the student center today where there is a lounge type area with several televisions. Every one had war coverage on, and every one had several people sitting in front watching with huge grins on their faces. Get it off television, because it is sick to turn a horrific event into a program that we enjoy like we are watching seinfeld. How can any American really not understand why 9/11 happened. That is all I have to say on this matter for good.

 

[radiofreecostarica]

Ok . We have all seen that. IS THE COVERAGE STILL ON ?????????

Yes. Live feed from 1991.

 

[Jazz]

Why would I torch you for saying your opinion? If I saw silly college students doing that, I'd be pissed too. But I doubt that mature Americans are reacting that way, since a lot of us know people in combat or have actually some compassion towards the people of Iraq, though I personally have none toward Saddam.

 

[grantt]

You forgot to mention like all Americans that the U.S. got involved 2 years later than Canada did. Something to do with the U.S. not getting involved in issues for humanitarian reasons only financial ones.

 

[Jazz]

So what? If the US had never gotten involved at all, in all honesty do you think Canada would have made any difference?

Get real

 

[radiofreecostarica]

do a google search on how IBM figured into the record keeping of the Holocaust.

yep. financial reasons. $$$

better yet:

http://www.villagevoice.com/issues/0213/black.php

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2002/03/27/print/main504730.shtml

 

[Oceans11]

But your not always right.
And your casualties were tiny compared to the USSR. Dont even try to go there.
WW2 was won on the Eastern front in the biggest battle in human history.

I dont hate you, but your country plays too many games. The USA cant be trusted, its too short term in its objectives.

I have a simple question.

Why didnt spain invade portugal in ww2?

Portugal is landlocked by spain, which was facist, and Portugal was a hotbed of allied espionage in ww2. Many refugees got out via P. and it was the destination in 'Casablanca'(Humphrey Bogart film) lia Lisbon.

So why was it so safe?
Why has Portugal not been invaded in 500years by spain.

Cos they have a treaty with Britain.(The longest in recent history actually)

Cos we might be a bunch of arses but we back our bullchit up. If we make a treaty then we are bound by it.

We helped the Faroes with the whaling regulations because they see the same long term values in treaties.
We dont like whale killing, even pilot whales, but its a tradition there.

Who the phuck are the Faroe Islands?

They are the ONLY country in the entire world who said they were on our side in 1940.
They weren't neutral, they were ON OUR SIDE.

Everyone else was still phaffing about, surrendering, or neutral, including the USA, and Portugal too btw. (you've got to be practical.)

I you want real allies, then do it for the long term, through the generations.
The USA has yet to embrace that principle.

I dont like war, but I know that I, and my people have obligations to certain people, and its a part of my history, and my future, and my culture, and the future of my country, and the culture we stand for, that we meet those responsibilities.
And I am very proud of that.
Its corny, but true.

I might be a fool. But Im not stupid.

[This message was edited by eek on 03-21-03 at 06:40 PM.]

 

[radiofreecostarica]

the US will never get involved as an altruistic gesture.

The giant must be provoked.
Sometimes oil provokes it, sometimes Pearl Harbor, the Sinking of the Lusitania etc. etc.

 

[Jazz]

eek, that I can agree with, that I'm not always right and that I was in this case.

About long-term allies, yes, we do have them (Canada and Britain come to mind), but establishing long-term alliances for a country as young as we has not been easy, especially considering the regimes in powerful countries we cannot support (China, the old USSR) and the changing nature of politics in other countries. Our involvement in NATO and the Cold War directly benefitted millions upon millions of people and still does - ask the East Germans and the former Soviet republics.

But what I DON'T like is the fact that we don't always go the distance - and I agreee upon that. If we do NOT do the right thing in post-war Iraq (though I think we will), along the lines of what we're doing for Afghanistan (who doesn't have oil), then I will be mighty pissed. But I don't think I will be.

Good point, eek - I've gotta split now, but that was a good point.

 

[radiofreecostarica]

for Afghanistan (who doesn't have oil),

No it doesn't. In fact, the only thing that the Bush Clan has been eyeing about Afghanistan is the geography and blueprint for a trans-Asiatic oil pipeline....